Review of 2011 Toyota Sienna

by philg

Folks:

I’ve drafted a review of the 2011 Toyota Sienna minivan and would appreciate comments/corrections. The debut of the latest Sienna is interesting because it was almost entirely designed in the U.S. as well as built in the U.S. and the result is almost exactly like something that G.M. would have built. I fear for Toyota shareholders when the new Honda Odyssey is released in the fall.

Thanks in advance.

11 thoughts on “Review of 2011 Toyota Sienna”

  2. Scientific American has an article of engine efficiency by a Honda Engineer.
    It is very hard that is why mpg have not increased while weight, safety and electorics
    has increased in 30 years.

    Preview

  3. May –

    Sure, engine efficiency is hard…after all, the thermodynamics of pumping cycles are a hard limit to any engine’s efficiency! But I think Philip is on target with his criticism, because what HAS gone up dramatically over the last 15 years or so is the horsepower of our vehicles. In the early nineties, 100-125 horsepower was sufficient to sell a family sedan like a Camry or Accord (notice I did not say ‘propel’ but ‘sell’). Nowadays it can be difficult to find a car with less than 200 horsepower. Why all the power? We don’t need it; 125 horsepower is enough to propel a 2500 or 3000 lb car to 60 mph in 8-10 seconds. That’s sufficient for any onramp in the universe. People don’t use their power anyway. Just drive on any freeway and watch for the multitude of 200 or 300 HP cars that get on the highway going 45 MPH.

    So, over the last decade and a half the world’s auto engineers have greatly upped the specific power of engines – that is, the HP per liter. Now that we can make much more HP per liter, we should be able to get away with 1 – 1.5 liter displacement engines and 40+ mpg.

    My ’93 Honda Accord has a 2.2 liter, 125 horsepower engine and never gets less than 32 MPG. 37 is not uncommon on road trips. Shall we pine for the good old days?

  4. Longleaf: The Cirrus SR20 four-seat airplane that cruises at 180 mph has a 200 horsepower engine. The Sienna that we test-drove had the 266 hp V6 engine. That’s more horsepower than a four-seat Robinson R44 helicopter. Why family cars need to be so heavy and powerful is beyond me, especially as the U.S. population continues to grow and traffic jams continue to worsen. In the Los Angeles area, a commuter would rarely need to accelerate to more than 35 mph.

  5. How many gallons/hour does the plane use at 180mph? I doubt the plane would hold-up very well in a crash. (Anyway, I’m happy to get 48mpg diesel in my car and it’s actually still faster than it needs to be.)

  6. njkayaker: The plane gets about 20 mpg (with an engine that was designed in the 1950s and with 1930s-style engine controls), but it goes directly from Point A to Point B. So the total number of gallons used in a typical trip is comparable to that of a car that gets 25-30 mpg. How does it hold up in a crash? You’re not supposed to crash airplanes into things! It gives the public a bad impression of aviation.

  7. The EPA changed the way it comes up with the MPGs in 2008:

    “Starting with 2008 models (which went on sale as early as January 2, 2007), the methodology for measuring and reporting fuel economy has been reworked to make published miles-per-gallon (mpg) ratings more accurate. The trouble for consumers is this: 2007 models and leftover 2006 vehicles on the lot next to the ’08s will appear to have superior fuel economy. But they don’t. This conundrum exists because 2007-and-earlier models use an Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) fuel economy measurement that is being phased out.”

    From: http://www.edmunds.com/advice/fueleconomy/articles/119812/article.html

  8. “Why all the power”

    basically that is the way american car companies were marketing
    their product. Just remember original Odyssey had four door
    like a car and accord frame and engine.

    Why do you think Acura RL aka Legend keeps getting criticized for V6
    because all the old people who drive luxury car need bragging point
    of V8.

    Only thing that Honda produces that is efficient is the FCX.
    if they can come up with in home refueling of H2 and/or
    reformation in the car then we can have what you are looking for.
    but just remember all the lithium supply would be exhausted by
    just 100 million car. Not to talk about all the other rare earth minerals
    are needed for this. Most of the rare earth minerals come from China.
    They are already trying limit the supply just to show their power.

  9. I may be wrong but high power engine is what makes a huge car feel responsive and agile at slow speeds. basically all this “wasted” power is a sacrifice for improved handling. 60 MPH cruising doesn’t need a lot of horsepower (hence higher mpg highway rating); some cars even shut off extra cylinders at high speeds.

  10. We have a 2010 Sienna, for which I am grateful to the American taxpayer – you guys all kicked in $4500 to get my 91 F150 off the road. Since it had a value of about $600, with a transmission which was in its last days, this was a deal I could not refuse. It’s largely as you describe the 2011, a competent but not very exciting vehicle. The seats are much improved over my old Windstar, in the convenience of getting them out of the way. Nice cup holder. The accelerator is somewhat unnerving – you can hear the engine moving faster or slower when you haven’t moved your foot up or down – we’ve been paying attention to this after the scandal/recall with the other Toyotas.

    It’s a perfectly okay car, but nothing to inspire fanatic loyalty like the early-90s Toyotas our friends had. When it comes time to replace it I won’t just automatically go out and buy another Toyota, but I won’t (as I did after my Taurus died at 60000 miles) actively try to avoid a Toyota, either.

  11. As a ’05 Sienna owner, I agree that the thing leans into corners _a lot_. Basically when you’re going on an exit ramp, you need to slow down big time! The vehicle basically drives like a big moving sofa.

    This is my third Toyota, and I can truly testify that Toyota quality ain’t what it used to be. Within the first few days, the seat platform was swapped out due to a squeak. The driver’s side seat squeaks but I have to put up with it because it will cost an arm and a leg to take it apart and rebuild. There are miscellaneous rattles from the roof area. The good news is that so far, *touch wood* nothing major has given way.

    While I’d gladly ditch Toyota the next time around, the problem is that there aren’t any other manufacturers with consistently better quality. Honda is close but doesn’t exceed. The American car makers have some vehicles that rate well in initial quality, but is quality over the life of the car that really matters.

    PS: Official advice from a mechanic at Toyota of Watertown when I complained about squeaks: “turn the radio up high”.

Comments are closed.