Question: Wouldn’t Hamas be finished in a few days if the typical Gazan were anti-Hamas? Presumably, the Islamic Resistance Movement (“Hamas”) couldn’t survive amidst civilians if they were hostile to the cause and told the IDF where to find the Hamas members, tunnel entrances, etc. Although we are informed that Gazans ran out of power in October and don’t have Internet, every video from Gaza shows people using fully charged smartphones and posting to social media. Thus, it would be easy for a Gazan who disagreed with Hamas to drop a dime on the nearest Hamas platoon.
In a November 2023 poll, about 13 percent of Palestinians had a “very negative” view of Hamas and 10 percent had a similarly negative view of Palestinian Islamic Jihad. I wonder if these numbers are way too high. If even 10 percent of “civilians” disagreed with the Hamas goals of defeating the IDF, eliminating the Zionist entity, liberating Al-Quds, and establishing a river-to-the-sea Hamas-ruled Palestinian state then that is way too many potential snitches for Hamas to relax.
How can the poll numbers be reconciled by the fact that, apparently, nobody in Gaza is cooperating with the IDF? There are people who don’t like Hamas in particular but agree with most of Hamas’s goals?
Note that the righteous estimate support for Hamas among Palestinians at approximately 0 percent, which would be even tougher to square with Hamas continuing to thrive right next to the IDF. Our greatest intellectual, for example, says “The overwhelming majority of Palestinians are not Hamas. And Hamas does not represent the Palestinian people. In fact, they’re also suffering as a result of Hamas’ terrorism.” If the typical Gazan thinks that he/she/ze/they is suffering, as Joe Biden says, why doesn’t he/she/ze/they drop a dime on the source of the suffering? If no dimes are dropped, shouldn’t we infer that Joe Biden is incorrect regarding Gazans suffering as a result of Hamas?
Related:
I imagine globalists in Gaza (and Israel) are in the same situation that they are here. The people hate them, don’t agree with anything they are doing, but due to lying, propaganda, and cheating they maintain control of power and don’t really care what happens to their citizens. Why would it be any different there?
In fact, the more death and destruction the better. The string pullers are clearly agnostic about where or to whom it occurs.
Ted — I don’t think I’ve heard the word “globalists” used in the context of this fight before.
I rarely understand what people mean when I hear the word, although I hear it used to refer to people who want open borders.
Who are the globalists to you in Gaza and Israel?
David, Hamas top commander Yahya Sinwar has lots of friends in world capitals. Biden admin tries to protect him, Canada cancelled (minuscule) arms sales to Israel over threat of finishing him. Even Israeli security services more keen of producing his pictures then his body. Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh lives in Qatar, a client state of both US and Iran and whose government finances large global enterprises Al Jazeera and Emirates airline.
Western international bodies and financiers pressure Israel to accept genocidal Hamas attack as cost of doing business with them. Why is it surprising when it is called globalism?
Perplexed — Is being friendly with foreign governments the thing that makes you a globalist?
Trump likes Putin and wants a strong relationship with him
Trump held hands with Rocketman when nobody else would deal with him.
Trump protected MBS when others wanted to punish him.
Trump relied on Mexico to implement US border policy (remain in Mexico).
Is Trump the globalist? Or is there another criteria I’m missing here?
David, Trump Derangement Syndrome is a serious affliction and I hope that you prevail over it, I am praying for you to recover soon.
I mentioned no Trump nor Biden, but let’s discuss topic of your suffering.
Trump was US president and handled foreign affairs pretty well, America enemies were quiet and allies were in peace. And there were no large regional wars. And Mexico was incentivized to turn off the spigot of cartel-fueled law-breaking.
Definitely Trump, unlike Biden, did not finance wars in the Middle East, did not pay Iran and did not reimburse Palestinian dictator for murdering Israelis.
Yahya Sinwar said that he planned 10/07 attack for 2 years – that’s is from 2021, way after first Trump presidency, when Biden had enough opportunities to show his true colors.
So yes, Trump can not be called globalist in modern sense of the world. Trump is a capitalist with international reach, who cares about his and his country’s profit.
Why MBS? Biden is begging MBS to increase oil production.
Perplexed — I wasn’t calling Trump the globalist.
I also didn’t want to get into a Trump vs Biden discussion.
I was trying to point out that your first examples of globalist behavior would also apply to Trump, and since it’s his fans that hate globalists, there’s obviously some other criteria that was missed.
I just want someone to explain it clearly because I’ve heard this term used for about 2 years now and nobody can seem to explain it.
I can’t think of any other term used in politics like it. Is it just a general insult like “douchebag”?
David: I’m a little confused by the term as well. Is a reasonable working definition of “globalist” an elite person whose loyalties are primarily to elites around the world rather than to the citizens of his/her/zir/their own country? Greta Thunberg isn’t super rich, but she could be considered a “globalist” because she never talks about Swedish issues and zips (by train!) from one European capital to another to interact with like-minded prominent folks in climate activism. Bill Gates, obviously, since he goes to Davos and gives away money in Africa rather than in the U.S.
Donald Trump is an example of an anti-globalist, most obviously with his “America First” philosophy. He was not and, probably, still is not interested in the welfare of elite Europeans or Chinese. He doesn’t voluntarily spend time in pow-wows with elite foreigners.
I used to work with several people who were in Yugoslavia in the 1990s. They eventually were admitted to Germany as refugees.
Our companies’ white/Asian management produced a steady stream of emails expressing fealty to movements such as BLM. They found this confusing. One of them explained why in a way that stuck with me (paraphrasing):
“””
When there is real conflict between groups, individuals don’t get to choose the side they are on. If others can see your race, you are on the side of that race. The people who hurt people who look like you don’t care what you think. The people who do look like you won’t help you if you are a traitor. Self-preservation makes you join “your side” for protection.
“””
I suspect the same dynamic is happening here. Imagine a Palestinian in Gaza who dislikes Hamas. Once the violence starts, he/she/they/zir/ze will be driven by fear to “support” Hamas:
* Fear of death by IDF bombs/bullets.
* Fear of being seen as a traitor by other Palestinians.
CL: Your theory makes sense, but if a noble Gazan goes into a closet and calls the IDF on his/her/zir/their smartphone how can other Gazans find out? (And, in any case, according to Joe Biden those other Gazans are unlikely to be in any way affiliated with or sympathetic to Hamas.) Gazans who own property in Rafah or who simply don’t want to move out of the city have a big incentive to tell the IDF where all of the Hamas, UNRWA, and Palestinian Islamic Jihad fighters are. If the Israelis could eliminate the armed Gazans without a ground invasion of Rafah they would certainly be happy to do so. (Though avoiding a ground invasion is not so important to the Israelis that they’re willing to do a US-/UK-style city-flattening bombing.)
CL: Consider a Gazan who owns an apartment building in Rafah. In the event of a fight between the IDF and Hamas/UNRWA/PIJ, the building is at risk of destruction from RPGs, tank rounds, artillery shells, etc. Insurance usually has a war exclusion. US/EU taxpayers will pay for rebuilding Gaza, presumably, but will they give ownership of a big new building to a Gazan merely because he/she/ze/they owned a big apartment building before the 2023-2024 battles?
@philg: I should not have put “support” in scare-quotes. Most people are not able to resist group-think when bullets are flying.
The Gazan who owns an apartment building, or who can make a cell phone call anonymously, lives in a group of people. Members of that group express a strong dislike of the IDF, driven by fear that they will be hurt. Members of that group express a strong approval of Hamas. Some of that is fear Hamas will hurt collaborators. Some of it is the positive feelings humans have for the enemies of those they fear (the IDF in this case).
Some rare humans in that situation would be able say “I don’t care that everyone around me thinks the IDF is bad and Hamas is good. I have an apartment building to preserve.” I don’t think more than one in one hundred people are that rational. Presumably these rare people don’t know where in the tunnel the leaders are.
I wonder if the IDF would believe a tip from a person in Gaza. The IDF has to wonder if the tip fake, and an invitation to walk into an ambush, send a missile at a hospital, etc. If only one in one hundred people would send a real tip, and most people would happily send a fake one, how does the IDF decide what to believe?
From everything i have read it seems there is a very high level of support for Hamas in both Gaza and in the areas controlled by the PA. And when there is opposition to Hamas it is never clear whether the opposition has anything to do with the atrocities Hamas committed on 10/7 — or people are just unhappy that their homes were destroyed, etc. — most likely just that their homes were destroyed People don’t get or don’t want to get the role Islam (a/k/a The Religion of Peace) plays in the Palestinian support for Hamas/hatred of the Jews. There is some good material out there with Mordechai Kedar — an Israeli Arabist. One with Caroline Glick on YouTube from about a month ago and this from the other day:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxLRfsIilY0
Why would typical anti-Hamas Gazans have any information useful for defeating Hamas? Doesn’t the IDF already know that the Hamas leadership is in either Rafah disguised as a sick old lady in one of the hospitals, somewhere in their rat holes underground or in a five star hotel in Europe?
Mitch: There are supposedly about 20,000 noble Hamas fighters left. They can’t all be underground or in Europe. So there should be perhaps 100,000 Gazans in and around Rafah who know that particular buildings are primarily occupied by noble Hamas fighters.
Does everyone in Gaza love, or at least agree with, Hamas? Yes!
Wouldn’t Hamas be finished in a few days if the typical Gazan were anti-Hamas? Yes!
How can the poll numbers be reconciled by the fact that, apparently, nobody in Gaza is cooperating with the IDF? The poll numbers cannot be reconciled.
There are people who don’t like Hamas in particular but agree with most of Hamas’s goals? No!
If the typical Gazan thinks that he/she/ze/they is suffering, as Joe Biden says, why doesn’t he/she/ze/they drop a dime on the source of the suffering? Everyone in Gaza love, or at least agree with, Hamas.
If no dimes are dropped, shouldn’t we infer that Joe Biden is incorrect regarding Gazans suffering as a result of Hamas? Joe Biden is frequently incorrect and is not “Our greatest intellectual”
If Hamas is caused to lose this war catastrophically in a humiliating manner, I bet THAT would hurt their polling numbers. Maybe that should be the goal.